|Montreal Fireworks Forum —› 2004 Display Reviews —› The Winner is Germany|
|Posted: Jul 28, 2004 18:35:07
The winner for 2004 is: Germany- Weco
This was reported by Paul by cell phone from the park moments ago.
Great Job to the Weco team
Great job Paul
|Posted: Jul 28, 2004 20:32:44 Edited by: badnitrus
Congrat to the german team,
Glad I saw that show. I guess the live orchestra and harmony of the display took the upper hand. It was unique and very clever. A little sad for Holland which I also really enjoyed, but all the other teams received a special Jupiter for their participation this year, so it's a great gesture from the organizers.
It was a memorable year, and I doubt we'll see something this big in the near future, although the competition is now at a very high level with the 20th anniversary being brought to an end.
Great job for Paul with the reports!
And you also predicted the winner.
Thanks a lot for your dedication!
Now, we'll have to wait another 11 months before the next display!
On a side note, Panzera's show was truly beautiful, but pretty much the whole display was ruined for all the people on Montreal's side because there was literally no wind, so... a LOT of smoke. But it did not ruin it for me. It was highly enjoyable, I liked the music.
Smoke, I did not bring my digital camera with me tonight... I was having some regrets when the display started, but I can say the video would have shown nothing except smoke and a few bright fireworks.....
Anyway, I hope the forum is still active during the year. Is it?
|Posted: Jul 28, 2004 20:45:23 Edited by: Smoke
Hello to everyone who saw tonight's show,
To start off, congrats on your prediction of Germany, Paul! It appears you were right all along! It's a shame I missed this display! badnitrus, I'm glad that you saw it! I guess that live orchestra really gave them the big advantage!
Anyways, the weather cooperated, after all! Although, it did seem very threatening at a point, with a small thunderstorm in the area to thje south! I was a bit worried, but it turned out ok. It passed the site quickly, and we were left with a comfortable evening to view a great display.
However, it seemed that the weather did influence this display, even with the absence of rain, none the less. This is why I and, I assume thousands of others, did not enjoy the display to the fullest, not because it was not a good show, but of the possible weather related problems. I know for sure it was due to the dense air mass, heavy humidity and definitely the lack of wind. I mean, the place was practically enveloped in smoke! There were even times when nothing could be seen at all! All there was for more than 50% of the show, was a giant cloud of smoke with lightning- like flashes and loud booms! Although, at least the finale wasn't that much obscured by the smoke, as much! What a finale! Very incredible and what an intense display all the way through, although I couldn't see it, but from what I heard from those bombs and multiple salutes, I could tell! A great classic Panzera finale and display! Anybody know how long it lasted?
Anyways, this may just be from where I watch, but I can tell you from Notre-Dame, there was only smoke to be seen. Anything different at La Ronde or anywhere else? It looked the same everywhere. La Ronde and downtown seemed to be swallowed in the swelling smoke! Since the display was so intense, the smoke build up volume and density was getting greater by the second! There were also times when we were inhaling the sulfur and smoke compounds! It was getting very hazy and thick! This didn't keep me from enjoying the final display for the 20th anniversary, though!
All in all, congratulations to Germany and an excellent weather record for the 20th anniversary! What a year! I enjoyed every minute of it! I would also like to congratulate all the participating firms for giving it your absolute best and giving all Montreal fireworks fans displays to remember for a long time! You all did an excellent job in your own unique and special way, which dazzled us in every possible way, no doubt! I wish every year was like this!
And badnitrus, you're right, it's so sad that it's over already. Now we have to wait a whole 10+ months again! I mean it was just the other day of the opening show! It was really hard for me to say good bye! an yes, it was a shame that no one could bring their camera to record the show and that wonderful classic finale! However, like you say, it would be tough to get a good shot because of all the smoke. I also feel the same way about you for Holland and also Italy, but it's no big deal because thay all got special Jupiters, none the less. I also agree with you on the music. It really was fast paced and made the display really intense and exciting. I like the music used for the end, too. Don't feel too bad about not bringing your camera because I'm sure some people actually attmepted and probably got better shots and views, and plus, it should be availabel anytime soon on the Mondial SAQ webite, including the finale. So, don't feel bad. You wouldn't get that much from where we were standing, anyways. A great display, despite the lack of some weather cooperation.
As for keeping the forum alive, no prob! As long as we can come up with things to talk about, we should be able to slip through 10-11 months with ease! I know there's going to be a lot till then, but I know we can do our best! I'll always be on this forum until then!
This year will always be something for every enthusiast to remember in the history of the competition! I can honestly never forget such a year of great calibur, intensity, excitement and tightness!
Well, next year is back to the old gold, silver and bronze Jupiters again!
|Posted: Jul 28, 2004 22:08:14
Also mentioned as being in the top three were Sunny International, representing China, and Lacroix-Ruggieri from France. I predicted the same in an email sent to Dave Demsey, who kindly posted tonight's results for me.
Definitely the correct result in my opinion - in fact, I was wearing a Weco T-shirt this evening because I was so sure.
|Posted: Jul 29, 2004 07:00:01
J'ai eu le privilège d'assister à tous les feux sur le même siège de la section 5 à la Ronde . Une année extraordinaire pour le Mondial SAQ, des spectacles de haut niveau de qualité par les meilleures firmes du monde. Félicitations à tous ces artificiers et chapeau à Mme Martine Gagnon et son équipe pour un organisation formidable à la hauteur de cette 20 ième présentation.
Je respecte profondément la décision du jury et leur choix de Weco pour le Jupiter platine.Pour avoir été memebre du jury à deux reprises je sais à quel point ce n'est pas un tâche facile en raison de la qualité des présentations et parce que l'art pyrotecnique demeure une présentation complexe composée de plusisuers éléments dont il faut tenir compte lorsque vient le temps d'inscrire les points sur sa feuille à la fin du spectacle et je vous prie de me croire que cà passe vite devant nos yeux. De plus cette année ce sont les meilleurs qui étaient à Montréal.
J'avais dit à plusieurs personnes que le gagnant serait le pays qui
serait le plus original et le plus créatif à tous les points de vue .
A ce chapitre j,ai été particulièrement impressionné par les présentations de l'Allemagne et de la Hollande.
De facon non-officielle j,ai jugé chacun des feux et avant le résultat final . J'avais porté mon choix sur la Hollande comme bon premier suivie de près par l'Allemagne et la Chine.
La présentation de Weco était de très grande qualité mais dans une compétition aussi serrée la marge d'erreur est très mince.
J'ai jugé que le dernier quart du feu avait été beaucoup moins efficace que les 3 premiers et surtout , bien des gens ont bien vus les trois "trous" parce que des rampes de pièces n'ont pas fonctionnées . Tu auras aussi observé que tout le côté gauche de la rampe #5 n'avait pas répondu à la mise à feu. Enfin j'ai trouvé la finale assez ordinaire et hors de tout argument politique je me suis bien demandé ce que venait faire le O Canada sur la trame sonore.
Mon choix pour le Jupiter Platine c'était JNS de la Hollande, une présentation vraiment très originale pendant laquelle j'ai complètement oublié le temps.Ce feu je le sentais bien avait été préparé de longue date avec beaucoup de minutie. Un spectacle vraiment créatif qui aura surpris et ému les spectateurs. D'ailleurs ll'équipe de JNS a recu une ovation bien méritée des spectateurs de la Ronde.
Le feu de la Chine avec l'implication du grand maitre Eric Tucker aura pour moi été le meilleur au niveau de la présentation technique et de la mise en scène. C'était presque parfait, de toute beauté. Toutefois il manquait l'originalité et la créativité et un meilleur choix musical. A ce chapitre c'était inégal.Le jour où M. Tucker tiendra plus compte de ces éléments dans la préparation de son spectacle il sera très difficile à battre.
Le feu de la France était extrêmement dense ne laissant aucun répit aux spectateurs.Même les passages doux étaient forts et parfois nous avions peine à entendre la musique. J'aime bien les feux équilibrés dosant savamment la puissance de l'art pyrotechnique et les moments plus tendres. Je ne sais pas si M. Jaumont a participé à l'élaboration de ce feu. Cà me surprendrait. Je me souviens très bien de son spectacle en 2002 je crois.Pour les deux tours Effeil ...bien beau mais peu utilisées contrairement à la Hollandeavec ses deux tours métalliques.
Voilà pour mon commentaire. C'est encore l'art pyrotecnique qui sort grandi de ce Mondial SAQ 2004. VIVE les FEUX de MONTREAL
|Posted: Jul 29, 2004 07:16:41 Edited by: Smoke
Looks like the jury had a tough time coming up with the winner! I don't blame them at all! It was so tight this year that a lot of firms were way up there! I think that it was a good choice. I was actually thinking, before they announced the winner, that it would be definitely between Holland, Germany and my personal favourite, Italy. Tough decision! At times, I even thought that Japan or China may have slipped in!
I hate when the competition goes so fast! I can't believe the 20th anniversary is already over! It's not fair! I guess we'll have to kill time again, until June 2005!
Anyways, like 2003, I would like to make a little movie of my own of all the small clips of each display, leading up to the Panzera finale! I hope the clips from Holland, France eand Germany include the creative parts, such as their towers integrated to the display.
Lets keep the fireworks spirit alive!
|Posted: Jul 29, 2004 07:58:53 Edited by: Enkil
in the begining of the competition, i predicted that Germany would win (becuz of there amazing performance in 2000)
well it was just prediction
althro i thought China would win after seeing all
althro i believe Spain (Caballer) should have won, and i heard Eric Godlin on the radio say that Spain was his favourite, also another guest who was with him said the same
Eric said when saw the show, "j'etait completement dans les patates" (just an expression, of course)
but i guess they didnt know what we knew, that the show suffered alot
i kinda (or really) was disspointed last nights closing
we couldnt see anything, i personally thought it was the worst show of this year (of course this is where i stood, and what i saw) yes i blame it at the wind
the whole 30min was a catastrophe, i could barely see anything
as usual, its a typical Panzera show, with alot of repetition, but what was sad, was the ending, it wasnt as tight as last years
i didnt see alot of explosion in the sky, only on the lower side, it was loud althro
i dont know, but personaly i was dispointed with the smoke, and the ending
maybe it wasnt a bad ending, but ill check it again
now the good news is: the new fresh schedule of 2005 will come
the bad news: we have to wait again (but time passes fast, no doubt :up
|Posted: Jul 29, 2004 09:15:00
It was a bit disappointing, heh? I really agree with you. It's not the display, it's the weather to blame. A truly beautiful display gone up in, well, smoke! I guess we were right about the rain not coming, although there were some threats in the surrounding areas, but they were to the southeast. If the rain had come, well why not say that we would not have seen anything at all! It was the humidity and the lack of winds, for sure. I was right about the humidity affecting smoke build up and the fact that the wind wasn't helping. The funny thing is that if there's no wind and high humidity, there's a probelem, but then again, it's also a problem if there's too much wind, like England, last year, for example. In fact, I've checked in with the forecast for the last 24 hours, and at 10:00 P.M, no wind speeds were recorded. The winds were expected to be at least 5km/h! At least that would've helped!
This is also why we felt the ending was disappointing, although you could see some of it, it still didn't give you the feeling. It's sad because that was the climax for the 20th anniversary. I feel bad about this. The ending was thunderous, though, but that's all that could be interpreted. I could see only the red shells the best, throughout the display. Sometimes the green was visible, too. However, most of the shells and salutes could not even be seen! I don't know if you noticed, but a lot of people were walking away. I hate when they do that, but you can't blame them. It was pretty much a big vortex of smoke with flashes. That was it for more than 50% of the display, or maybe even 75%! It's such a shame!
So, in essence, the ending wasn't that disappointing only because we could barely see it. We definitely hear it, though! Very loud! This is why I'm hoping that someone was fortunate enough to capture that ending on tape, but with a good view, without interference of the smoke, although everywhere looked the same!
As for next year, I guess we can kill time like we did last year! 10-11 months and counting!
BTW, Enkil, were you on De Lorimier and Notre-Dame or the bridge, last night?
|Posted: Jul 29, 2004 09:40:24
yeah i was there and i yeah i saw alot of ppl leaving
i want to email mondialsaq.com and tell them to post the ending like last year
were the ppl from La Ronde able to see it???
|Posted: Jul 29, 2004 10:51:16 Edited by: Smoke
Yes, I agree. I'll also try to E-Mail them to see if they can do that. i just want to add it to my big colloection of display clips. I hope they were able to capture the finale with a good view. We really missed out last night! What a waste to end the 20th anniversary! Of all days, the wind didn't blow last night! That isn't fair!
I hope the people at La Ronde were able to see it! Paul would know.
|Posted: Jul 29, 2004 11:00:02
We were able to see more than people on the Montreal side of the river, that's for sure. All the low level stuff was visible most of the time and the high level shells were obscured between 30% and 40% of the time, perhaps even more. But even then, some shells were visible, particularly the higher ones. It did detract from the display to an extent, but I think we were a lot luckier than the people on the banks of the river and the bridge.
|Posted: Jul 29, 2004 11:08:11
thanks for you insights into this year's competition. JNS's display was certainly very creative but I think they lost points on the "brightness and richness of the colours" criterion. I know many people didn't like the music; same thing with China. Personally, I really loved the Chinese soundtrack and thought it worked very well. That's just my opinion though! I also know some people didn't like the German soundtrack, probably because it was "classical" sounding and also unfamiliar. As for including part of the theme to O Canada in the final part, I thought it was entirely appropriate to the theme of the display - particularly since no Canadian company competed this year. That tune works quite well to fireworks (having scripted it myself for a Canada Day display). There were also snippets of themes from all sorts of other cultures too - which was the whole point of the display - emphasizing the multi-cultural nature of Cologne and Montreal. I was happy to hear English Hornpipe music in an earlier section of the soundtrack. Whatever we may perceive as politics living here, externally the view is quite different I think and the final track was entitled "Canadian Overture". As for the finale not being as intense as other displays, that's also true, but I found the entire German production was completely in harmony with both the soundtrack and the fireworks used. Looking at past displays be Weco, they are not known for having a large finale and so I think it was good that they stuck to their signature style.
To be honest, my biggest surprise of the evening was to hear that Lacroix-Ruggieri were in the finalists. Not that their display wasn't good, but, to my mind, they had just too many small errors to merit being in the top three when we had displays such as JNS and IPON which were technically close to flawless, let alone Marutamaya which was absolutely flawless, save for 2 shells which flowerpotted. Oh well, I guess including music by Celine Dion still works its magic
|Posted: Jul 29, 2004 11:55:21 Edited by: Smoke
Hmm......maybe I would be lucky if I won that ticket after all!
Yeah, I agree with Roger. I thought for sure Holland and Italy would be there! I'm also surprised to see France in the finalists, too! Well, they were a good show, but with all those small errors and tower 2 catching a fire, I didn't think they would make it! I guess it was the choice of music. I was also hoping for Italy to be in the finalists, too because they did such a great job in pretty much every sector and one great finale! I think this is the display people enjoyed the most! Holland, too. I'm happy that China ended up in there, though!
|Posted: Jul 29, 2004 13:32:40
Bonjour les passionnés des feux,
J'ai lu avec beaucoup d'attention et d'intérêt tous commentaires des membres de ce forum. Cà illustre parfaitement que chaque personne voit le feu à sa facon et c,est bien ainsi.
Et le jury populaire c'est comme cà. Voilà pourquoi j'espère que l'organisation du mondial SAQ va maintenir un nombre suffisant de jurés pour 2005 et pour moi le minimum est vraiment de 20. L'an dernier nous n'étions que 15 pour juger une compétition où 6 firmes s'étaient livrés une compétition farouche pour s'inscrire parmi les gagnants.
Dans une telle situation la pression sur les votes de chacun devient très forte et un juge plus " faible" peu faire basculer les résultats à lui seul.
Il n'en demeure pas moins que le jury populaire bien encadré demeure le meilleur gage d'honnêteté et d'objectivité pour les firmes participantes.
A l'instar de quelques membres de ce forum comme Enkil, Smoke et toi Paul je trouve bien déplorable que la finale a du se faire avec ce foutu panache de fumée. De l,endroit où j'étais placé dans la section 7 nous avons manqué plusieurs beaux effets particulièrement les bombes de gros calibres provenant de la rampe 1 sur les abords du fleuve. On ne peut pas contrôler cà.
Je me dis chanceux que la température ait été si convenable pour tous les feux en compétition.Pour le bouquet final Smoke tu pourrais regarder la finale de Royal Pyrotechnie en 2003. C'était très ressemblant.
Pour la trame sonore de cette Finale ...assez bon sauf que personnellement j'aime bien une trame bien mixée avec des enchaînements harmonieux entre les différents tableaux un peu comme Royal pyrotecnie l,avait fait l'an dernier . Cà donne du rytme à la présentation et cà transporte l'intérêt du spectateur.Les trames sonores d'Eric Tucker ont aussi ces qualités et moi cà me transporte.
Pour le feu de l'Allemagne Paul, j'ai lu tes commentaires lesquels sont toujours très bien faits et m,aident à améliorer mes connaissance en matière d'art pyrotechnique.
Peu importe le pays ( comme la France l'a fait l'an dernier) je n'aime pas entendre les hymnes nationaux pendant une prestation pyromusicale..avant oui mais pas pendant. Il y a ici au Québec beaucoup de chansons qui auraient pu convenir comme par exemple "Je reviendrai à Montréal de Robert Charlebois".
La chute d,eau de l'allemagne avec en bas la cathédrale de Cologne était magnifique, très réussie . Manquer un tel tableau aurait été catastrophique pour WECO mais souvenons nous que la firme avait aussi fait cette chute en 2000...
J'ai lu Paul que tu avais concu un feu d,artifice récemment. J'aurais bien aimé voir cà Si tu récidives fais-le moi savoir. Je ne doute pas une seul instant que cfe doit être une entreprise vraiment ardue et complexe.
Je vous salue tous.
|Posted: Jul 29, 2004 13:49:32
"La chute d,eau de l'allemagne avec en bas la cathédrale de Cologne était magnifique, très réussie . Manquer un tel tableau aurait été catastrophique pour WECO mais souvenons nous que la firme avait aussi fait cette chute en 2000... "
but is that an ok thing to do? or a bad thing?
|Posted: Jul 29, 2004 13:59:21
your comments are, as always, insightful and well made. I agree that a larger jury is less susceptible to the normal human frailty than a smaller one. Recall in the past that the jury was composed of 25 people. In those days, I don't recall any controversy over the result. That said, in those days we didn't have competitions which were as close as the one fought last year.
For the music of the German display, I must admit I was surprised when I finally realized that part of the theme from O Canada was playing! I also read in George Lamon's report that there were themes also taken from Alouette (which I recognized from childhood French lessons back in England) and Gens du Pays which I only realized afterwards. It must be a challenge for a composer in the heartland of Europe to come up with an original piece of music which incorporates sufficient threads of familiarity for the local audience. I very much like "Je reviendrai à Montréal" by Robert Charlebois and, in fact, incorporated this into a pyromusical proposal for Canada Day. In the end, the display that was fired was not pyromusical but I certainly had some fun choosing the music and scripting parts of it for the proposal.
You can be assured that if (actually when) I design another display, I will inform all members of this forum so they can attend and write their critiques! I can tell you that the actuality of firing a display is a lot of work and far from glamourous - though, as the old saying in pyro circles goes "he who hath once smelled the smoke, is ne'er againfree" [hath=has, ne'er=never] - a sentiment I'm very much in agreement with!
|Posted: Jul 29, 2004 14:01:47
if I may be permitted to speak for Roger, I think he is saying that Weco took a great risk with that massive waterfall. If the wind was in the wrong direction or it had failed to fire properly (as these things are wont to do) then it would have really put a dead spot in their display. They also took a great risk using a live orchestra - imagine how it would have been if it was raining! The final result, though, really illustrates that risk-taking is an essential part of being successful.
|Posted: Jul 29, 2004 14:10:27
That's very true.
If it did rain...what would've happened!? Imagine something like that! They really took a big risk, especially with the weather! Sometimes you just can't trust it! For their sake, I'm glad everything went well! Out of all the years I've been attending the competition, that is by far the most biggest chance ever attempted! What are the chances of having the proper wind speeds, let alone right direction, no rain, assuming the humidity contributing to smoke build up! That's a big risk, indeed! Did they take these into consideration before they were to plan such a display?
|Posted: Jul 29, 2004 14:12:21
but r firms allowed to use these type of effects if they have already used in the past? and would be considered as an ok thing to do or bad (for the judges)
|Posted: Jul 29, 2004 14:19:57
Of course they are! There's only so many effects which can be done with fireworks and to exclude ones which have been used before wouldn't make any sense. As for the judges, most years the jury is composed of new people so they may not have even seen something from the past re-used. The main danger with re-using ideas is that they can become cliched. We saw this in the past couple of years with people using very fast comet chase sequences. These can work very well if properly integrated with the music, but often-times they were, in my opinion, over-done and not really related to the music.
As always, these are just my opinions
|Posted: Jul 29, 2004 14:43:38
I really enjoyed the last display of this year's competition, even though the smoke covered a portion of the fireworks. I was standing on the bridge, above Île Sainte-Hélène, very close to La Ronde, so I think that the view was relatively good, judging by what I heard from a friend who was standing on Notre-Dame street in Montreal who said she missed most of the display due to the smoke. In the first 10 minutes, the smoke was quite bad, but as time went by, it seemed to get a bit better....specially for the finale, where the cloud of smoke seemed to get higher, clearing the sky somewhat. Anyway, I will post my comments later, but I wanted to let you know that I took a clip of the finale with my digital camera, and it turned out pretty nice.
|Posted: Jul 29, 2004 14:50:59
That's great! Well, like your friend said, we really were unfortunate to miss a great display gobbled up in smoke on Notre-Dame and other adjacent streets!
Even the finale was less than it should've been, especially the way the smoke spoiled it!
|Posted: Jul 29, 2004 20:16:48
I just noticed... the three teams nominated for the Platinum Jupiter were also the three who competed last: China, France and Germany.
... Ok that's all I had to say.
|Posted: Jul 30, 2004 06:34:02
Now that you mention it, you're right! It never occured to me!
BTW, did you hear what one of the guys said about Caballer's display on the radio? He said that he was in "the patates!" I guess you can tell what that means! Enkil had told me this. I actually heard their disscussion about what they thought of them! They say it was out of this world, especially that thunderous and continuing finale! Of course, this is in terms of excitement, despite all that happened to them. It was truly exciting! A display I can never forget. I was the most exciting this year, once again, in terms of excitement. Did anybody hear this on radio on 107.3?
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